An Interview With Sirio Maccioni

L.G.: There was talk that you might relocate in one of the Trump hotels. You didn't. Why not?

S.M.: Because, you see, there is a union. I protect my employees. I don't need a gangster from the outside to come in and tell me how I run the restaurant.

L.G.: How do you get away with that in New York?

S.M.: The hotels are union. Most of the restaurants are not union. That's because the union is very bad. At Circo we don't have a union. But Circo is happy. The people don't like to pay $100 a month to the union for nothing. Believe me, we know that if somebody gets sick here, I take him to my doctor, at 78 East 70th Street. If they are with the union they have to take a train and go to Brooklyn and they don't even know if they can come back.... You can unionize a restaurant in a hotel because the hotel doesn't want a strike. But here, they cannot come in.

L.G.: What portion of your fixed cost is employees—waitstaff and busboys, etcetera?

S.M.: Thirty-five percent. It's payroll 35 percent. Food and wine 30 to 35 percent. Overhead 35 percent.

L.G.: What kind of profit margin?

S.M.: New York is the lowest profit margin in the world. Always. From  8 percent to a maximum of 10 percent. Very dangerous.

L.G.: You are only making, at most, 10 percent here?

S.M.: Now I don't make anything.

L.G.: But in the best of all possible worlds, if you are making a $100,000 profit a month then you are doing okay.

S.M.: We hope that we would be able to do a little bit more than that.

L.G.: Okay, fine, but why are you in this business and not in a more profitable business with higher margins?

S.M.: First of all, no bank will give you 10 percent for your money. And, for example, we don't make money here, but they pay us for our name in Las Vegas, in Mexico City. Same in the Dominican Republic. It's more of a franchise.... Then we are in the process of opening one in London. That is an ego trip. That's also very expensive to do things there, and they are very difficult people. If you go to London, you have to go with the idea to be among the best.

L.G.: So how do you make sure that it is up to your standards?

S.M.: We have to find the right people. In Vegas, one of my sons lives there, Mario. And he is also working for MGM and has a very good salary. And Mauro is running Circo. It may be one of the most successful restaurants in New York, because it's strictly New York. And so each one of us has a salary.

L.G.: You and your sons have an equal share in this?

S.M.: We do that, and my wife [Egidiana Maccioni]. She is a pain in the neck but she is my wife. My wife is there at Circo. She's there now. My wife was one of the most famous singers in Italy. Actually she's the one who introduced Julio Iglesias to the Italian public in 1961, and she toured in New York and Canada. She had a one-woman show in Carnegie Hall.

L.G.: When did you get married?

S.M.: We got married in 1964.

L.G.: What took you so long? You started dating in 1957, didn't you?

S.M.: It was the best thing I did in my life and I was very lucky. Because if you're lucky, you're really lucky. But to me, at nights sometimes I could wake up and get scared.

L.G.: So the restaurants that you own are just here in New York?

S.M.: Yes, this we own.

L.G.: If you're an experienced waiter, how much can you make here?

S.M.: From a minimum of $2,000 over five days, eight hours a day. I am the only one that does 16 hours.

L.G.: And they all get benefits?

S.M.: Yes, they do okay.

L.G.: How are the corporate taxes here in New York?

S.M.: Very expensive. Double, double, double.

L.G.: Does Mike Bloomberg come in?

S.M.: Yes. I asked if he's running for president. He told me two days ago, no.

L.G.: Are you against the smoking ban?

S.M.: I don't smoke, and if you provide a room with enough ventilation I think it is nonsense. The second you go out in the street, you have that problem. Anyplace you go. That is an ego political trick. I am sorry. You can do something much better than that. They can do better health care for the people. Better hospitals.

L.G.: So this is something you have to live with.

S.M.: Yes. For example, it is because of this that some good people for New York come here less than before the smoking ban. Rich Mexicans, they don't come on vacation to New York anymore. Don't tell a Mexican that he cannot smoke and have a cognac. You ask a Mexican, "Why are you eating?" He says, "I'm eating so I can have a great cigar and the cognac."